I don't know what the drinking age in every country is, although I've got a fair idea. While I'm going to say right now drinking alcohol is probably not the most productive thing to do it is a pleasurable activity to many. I would even go as far to say that many drinking laws particularly in the US are too harsh. First of all the age for buying beer and wine should be lowered to 16. Laws are already as tough as possible for underage drunk drivers.
This is also the age where people can get their license, or consent to sexual intercourse. This is clearly an age of change. As for alcohol I firmly believe if you are old enough to vote, or die for your country then you are old enough to buy hard alcohol. Instead of a prohibition approach to alcohol we should be promoting it with responsibility, sensibility, and moderation.
It's more or less proven the more alcohol is vilified, and controlled the more harm it seems to create. If it is advertised by sources such as public schools that it is a means of self destruction, more people are going to turn to it as a means of self destruction. It's a strange human phenomenon. If you leave it as something that is "good in moderation" and show it as such society will be more likely to follow.
Anyone who says a 16-20 year old couldn't possibly be a responsible drinker, I ask those of you who do drink when you had your first sip. If anything 16 is being very tight on the issue. This will also open up dialogue between parents, and their kids about drinking. Without the need to sneak things around there will be fewer incidents of drunk driving. Mainly because teenagers won't feel the need to go anywhere when it would be inappropriate to go.
That would be a bad thing in Australia, as binge drinking is a pretty big deal here.
Quote from: Jesus Christ;1443799As for alcohol I firmly believe if you are old enough to vote, or die for your country then you are old enough to buy hard alcohol.
Fucking signed.
It isn't even a question of whether the people could responsibly drink-- I don't think it's the government's right to tell a person what is "responsible" and what is not. If a person wants to destroy their life through alcoholism then that's entirely their decision. As long as they aren't endangering others, it's their own fucking business what chemicals they put into their body. Eventually it's all going back to the argument over whether or not our government should act paternal... should they treat us like a child and hold our hand, give out rules to protect ourselves from ourselves, or treat us like big boys and let us do whatever the fuck we want given that we don't involve others?
It should be 18 i am tired of getting drunk and havin to creep around trying to hide from cops nd shit
ps im drunk now and i ahd to hide from cops today and it cut my frinkin over ealry so fuck them
Quote from: PatriotClock;1443803It should be 18 i am tired of getting drunk and havin to creep around trying to hide from cops nd shit
ps im drunk now and i ahd to hide from cops today and it cut my frinkin over ealry so fuck them
Fuck the police
Comin' straight from the underground
Quote from: SombraClock;1443804Fuck the police
Comin' straight from the underground
young nigga go it bad cuz hes brown
and not the otha color so police thing they ahve the authority to kill a minority fuck that shit cuz i aint the one one punk muthafucka with his abdge and his gun get beat on and thrown in jail we could go toe to toe in the middle of a salew fuckin with my cuz im a teenage r wirth a little bita gold nd a pager
i love nwa is godd to listen to know
I support this on two reasons. One is for the overall safety of the people. I'll admit when I was under age I drank. I don't recommend young people drink either. Nonetheless I will say that people should not be needlessly embarrassed with arrests, courts, jail time, or other means of wasting tax payer dollars. The only reason a drunk should ever be arrested is for being a reckless danger to society.
Nobody should ever have to hide from the cops just for having some fun. Besides I'm pretty sure when you're 16 years old you've got a fairly decent understanding of the world. This government should not dictate the personal well being of it's citizens by means of morality or health. It's not only wrong in it's own moral right(as it is condescending) it's also a waste of tax payer dollars.
I would much rather have cops out on the street arresting real criminals. Even if that meant not having as many cops out on the street because of a lack of arrests.
In Australia we get everything at 18. Voting rights (which is actually compulsory), driver's license, sex, R rated movies, the whole shabang.
To be honest, age really has nothing to do with it, its all about the person. Some people know when to stop, some don't and set a bad example for our generation. Then everyone thinks that ALL us young adults can't drink responsibly, or treat women with respect, or drive at the speed limit, or appreciate art, or anything. Its all these arseholes ruining it for all the responsible people out there.
We need to get rid of arseholes, they suck.
Quote from: War Correspondent Clock;1443869In Australia we get everything at 18. Voting rights (which is actually compulsory), driver's license, sex, R rated movies, the whole shabang.
To be honest, age really has nothing to do with it, its all about the person. Some people know when to stop, some don't and set a bad example for our generation. Then everyone thinks that ALL us young adults can't drink responsibly, or treat women with respect, or drive at the speed limit, or appreciate art, or anything. Its all these arseholes ruining it for all the responsible people out there.
We need to get rid of arseholes, they suck.
I'm not saying these problems don't exist. But should we let them kill the party for everyone else? I say we throw them in jail like we were going to anyhow, and let the responsible folks be.
it's already 16 over here yo.
Quote from: PirateClock;1443885it's already 16 over here yo.
Land of infinite possibilities.
over here in merry old england, the legal age for buying is 18, but most corner shops don't give a crap and parents, unless religious, all understand that their kids will drink once they are inclined to because they did it themselves. I'm underage by a few months and my dad just went abd bought me a shit load of beer. nothing wrong with that, but it would have been nice if I was able to by it myself for the last 2 years
18 seems to be the best age, it gives you those sneaky couple of years before to test drinking while still being at a semi-responsible age.
YoYo would you agree this country has a rather big drinking-habit though? Not that it's a bad thing, it just seems to be a big part of social interaction over here, probably just bias based on living 30mins. from London in a built-up-area.
16 for smoking and 18 for drinking seems the perfect ages imo.
Quote from: INoodle;144389218 seems to be the best age, it gives you those sneaky couple of years before to test drinking while still being at a semi-responsible age.
YoYo would you agree this country has a rather big drinking-habit though? Not that it's a bad thing, it just seems to be a big part of social interaction over here, probably just bias based on living 30mins. from London in a built-up-area.
16 for smoking and 18 for drinking seems the perfect ages imo.
yes it is a big part of social interaction. but thats fine really as long as you don't go all alcoholic
To the young, drinking is seen as a way to party, be obnoxious, and let themselves go wild with their friends. They drink not to calm down or loosen up--like their parents usually would--but make it an activity in and of itself. The reason is, simply, that the only people from whom they can learn to drink are other underaged drinkers. Herein lies the biggest problem with the 21-year-old age limit: the fact that they make young adults wait until they're almost certainly away from their parents before they can drink effectively guarantees that children don't learn responsible drinking from their family, so they end up learning to do it the same way all the other underaged drinkers do: binging and partying.
Children need to be able to learn responsible drinking habits from their parent(s), because when they legally aren't allowed to, they learn to treat alcohol as something meant to be consumed secretly and abusively, causing accidents and police work that end up hurting lives and wasting tax dollars.
This is not to mention the standard "drinking shouldn't be higher up than dying in battle or voting" stuff.
16 year olds are responsible enough to drink themselves into a coma, but they're not responsible enough to not do packie runs for 12 year olds. Purchasing ages don't prevent drinking, they prevent buying. I think the age in the US is just fine.
I don't really care about the drinking age, but the taxes should be increased, you people aren't going to drink any less, but there will be more money for the government.
I think the intention is to ensure that students have left high school before they start purchasing alcohol, as this would probably encourage of-age parties to purchase alcohol for minors. It seems reasonable enough when you look at it that way.
Quote from: Obroxious Groovebag;1443915I don't really care about the drinking age, but the taxes should be increased, you people aren't going to drink any less, but there will be more money for the government.
Fuck that, booze is taxed enough and I have to buy it with taxed money. I want a good taste in my mouth and some relaxed muscles after work without spending all my cash.
It should be legal for minors to imbibe with parental supervision. This is as it should be, because it's their job to raise them. As always, crappy parents are a problem.
The U.S. drinking age is ridiculous. I've been to Canada many times, and at age 19 I was the same person over the border that I was below it.
Quote from: joliet_jane;1444276As always, crappy parents are a problem.
I've been saying this shit for years.
18 in the UK always has been
(although now you need to prove your age if you look younger than 21)
Quote from: joliet_jane;1444276It should be legal for minors to imbibe with parental supervision. This is as it should be, because it's their job to raise them. As always, crappy parents are a problem.
The U.S. drinking age is ridiculous. I've been to Canada many times, and at age 19 I was the same person over the border that I was below it.
Sort of, but regardless of how involved they might want to be, the school raises their kids. When the kid's out of school they want to do shit with their friends. Doesn't leave a lot of time for parenting. Of course, that's by design. The mass schooling system we use is based on the one developed in Prussia after WWI as part of an effort to increase nationalism. The entire point is to focus away from individual families toward the larger body of society.
16 over here(Portugal). As for the age of consent, it's 14-18.
I agree with these numbers. It can teach young people about responsibility, there should however be some sort of process defining whether the person is or not responsible in order to avoid trouble.
Quote from: Masquatto;1443900To the young, drinking is seen as a way to party, be obnoxious, and let themselves go wild with their friends. They drink not to calm down or loosen up--like their parents usually would--but make it an activity in and of itself.
If you need to drink to calm down you have a problem, not maturity. That's what we like to call an addiction.
guys, shut up, who cares, it's only drinking
people should be free to do whatever self-destructive thing they want
only when it comes to harming others should it become an issue.
Quote from: Masquatto;1443900This is not to mention the standard "drinking shouldn't be higher up than dying in battle or voting" dingen.
That's not the point of the age of consent. Otherwise everything would be age-controlled based on degree of honorability. You must be this high to duel.
Quote from: Fucko;1444308If you need to drink to calm down you have a problem, not maturity. That's what we like to call an addiction.
I don't drink, but if I did, having a drink to calm down is rather normal, and wouldn't hurt me or other people in any way (addiction is when it negatively affects other parts of your life). The point was that if you be mature enough to only drink a little--enough to calm yourself down, but not get hammered--then I don't see the problem in you drinking.
I wasn't trying to suggest that NEEDING alcohol is a sign of maturity, and I find it unnecessary that you even bother to talk about it when you know (or, at least, really should've been able to figure out) that such wasn't my intention.
Quote from: Fucko;1444314That's not the point of the age of consent. Otherwise everything would be age-controlled based on degree of honorability. You must be this high to duel.
If you're old enough to kill or be killed, I don't care if they call it honor or judgment or maturity or brain development--you're old enough to have a beer. It's a matter of principle. If they have the right to end your life at a specific age, you deserve to choose how you live at that age.
And if you're going to talk about realistic problems with underaged drinking, just look at the larger portion of my first post.
I don't drink. I don't understand why others can't seem to hold onto any kind of self-control.
It's not even my raising or anything, my parents most definitely are not anti-drinkers. I've even been offered it by my parents a few times.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1444451I don't drink. I don't understand why others can't seem to hold onto any kind of self-control.
People who drink don't usually do so because of lapses in self-control or judgement. There are people who
desire to drink, maybe unlike yourself, and it isn't a guilty pleasure, either. There is no part of their conscience telling them that getting drunk every now and then is irresponsible or wrong simply because of the fact that alcohol is a drug.
It's not a matter of temptation, is what I'm saying. If it were, you would probably be just as susceptible to it and be inclined to understand why people "can't hold onto any kind of self-control."
Or maybe Marlin doesn't drink because he doesn't want to. Maybe he doesn't like the taste of it or something who knows. Either way I think an early introduction to alcohol will lead to a more responsible means of drinking habits. As for the dumbshits who ruin it, they're going to do it anyhow.
I'm 18 I don't feel like I need to get drunk, or even drink. On the occasions that I do want to though, it isn't difficult to just stay in my dorm.
I have the same feeling about the drinking age as I have toward marijuana laws. It isn't hard to hide either of them if you actually are responsible about it. If you get caught and in trouble, you evidently weren't being responsible about it and therefore I guess the laws are justified.
Quote from: Flux;1444569I'm 18 I don't feel like I need to get drunk, or even drink. On the occasions that I do want to though, it isn't difficult to just stay in my dorm.
I have the same feeling about the drinking age as I have toward marijuana laws. It isn't hard to hide either of them if you actually are responsible about it. If you get caught and in trouble, you evidently weren't being responsible about it and therefore I guess the laws are justified.
Responsible use does not necessarily require that the use be hidden. In fact it's the opposite, because if you need to hide it it means you're doing it when you shouldn't be, like when you're at work. And most people are arrested for marijuana use within their own homes, as a result of a search or intrusion by the police. Besides that, what if you want to get high out in the daylight, like at the park on a nice day? I think it's an underthought qualifier of responsibility.
I drink, but I don't drink to excess. Getting full just doesn't appeal to me.
Also hangovers are a bitch.
Quote from: Fucko;1444579Responsible use does not necessarily require that the use be hidden. In fact it's the opposite, because if you need to hide it it means you're doing it when you shouldn't be, like when you're at work. And most people are arrested for marijuana use within their own homes, as a result of a search or intrusion by the police. Besides that, what if you want to get high out in the daylight, like at the park on a nice day? I think it's an underthought qualifier of responsibility.
Public highness should be treated the same as public drunkenness, first of all. So getting high at a park would still be unacceptable. And no, drug raids do not account for the majority of incarcerations of marijuana users. Most marijuana users get in trouble because they found it absolutely necessary to have and use pot outside the safety of their home. Drug raids are the minority. Even in a college dorm... if I got baked or drunk off my ass right now this very second no one would know. Because no one else is here. Therefore I'm not getting caught, because I'm in the safety of a private home-ish environment.
Responsibility with mind-altering substances, in my book, means that you are staying at home if you intend to do a substantial amount. If you intend to get drunk or high, you should be in the safety of a home, be it yours or a friend's. Having one or two drinks at a restaurant is fine. But if you intend to get incoherently
drunk, even at a bar, you aren't doing the right thing. You should be in the safety of a home.
Quote from: Flux;1444952Public highness should be treated the same as public drunkenness, first of all. So getting high at a park would still be unacceptable. And no, drug raids do not account for the majority of incarcerations of marijuana users. Most marijuana users get in trouble because they found it absolutely necessary to have and use pot outside the safety of their home. Drug raids are the minority.
Responsibility with mind-altering substances, in my book, means that you are staying at home if you intend to do a substantial amount. If you intend to get drunk or high, you should be in the safety of a home, be it yours or a friend's. Having one or two drinks at a restaurant is fine. But if you intend to get incoherently drunk, even at a bar, you aren't doing the right thing. You should be in the safety of a home.
I disagree. Public drunkeness is much more dangerous than being high in public. Drug raids don't happen but brown nosers do like to point these silly things out. All that aside we need some tolerance when it comes to a little bit of uh... Stupidity. We are all stupid people who do stupid things. Instead of throwing people in jail for silly stupid things they should simply get a slap on the wrist. The law may work in the sense that it busts irresponsible people, but it doesn't work in the sense that the punishment doesn't fit the crime.
Quote from: Groucho Marx;1444552Or maybe Marlin doesn't drink because he doesn't want to. Maybe he doesn't like the taste of it or something who knows.
That's what I meant. His "self-control" is not relevant because he doesn't want to drink to begin with. I'm allergic to and hate the taste of carrots, so my amazing perseverance in abstaining from carrots shouldn't be used to judge people who love carrots and are struggling with abstaining from carrot munching. Dicks.
For the risk of sounding like a loser;
I've never drunken, never plan to drink, and I can't believe such a ridiculous practice is so popular. I recognize it has health benefits in small doses, but nobody drinks it like that.
But, I still respect that people should have the right to do such things if they want to. It's not the governments place to tell you what you can or can not do to your own body. If people want to use mind altering drugs or even guzzle draino that's their right.
16 is plenty old enough to understand the situation.
They should just make it 18 if you can vote and die for your country at this age you should be able to drink!
Quote from: Fucko;1445046That's what I meant. His "self-control" is not relevant because he doesn't want to drink to begin with. I'm allergic to and hate the taste of carrots, so my amazing perseverance in abstaining from carrots shouldn't be used to judge people who love carrots and are struggling with abstaining from carrot munching. Dicks.
I think being allergic to something and not partaking in it is a different situation all together.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445146I think being allergic to something and not partaking in it is a different situation all together.
You're getting wrapped up into the details of the comparison. Keep your eye on the point.
Quote from: Blackmagic;1445172You're getting wrapped up into the details of the comparison. Keep your eye on the point.
If the details are faulty, then the comparison is faulty.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445200If the details are faulty, then the comparison is faulty.
yeah, how could something be the same if the deatils are different?
Because those details are irrelevant to the argument. If I hadn't mentioned that I'm allergic to uncooked carrots it would be even MORE accurate, because there's nothing to indicate that Marlin is allergic to all known alcoholic beverages.
It would be a better analogy if you picked something that sucks less than carrots.
Quote from: Thor;1445229It would be a better analogy if you picked something that sucks less than carrots.
Some people like carrots. You and I do not. Some people like drinking. You and Marlin do not.
how about, people can do whatever self-destructive thing they want, and you should stop trying to meddle in their lives.
In this thread I learned that people suck at comprehending illustrative examples.
Quote from: Maltese;1445611how about, people can do whatever self-destructive thing they want, and you should stop trying to meddle in their lives.
I think it should be in everyone's heart that letting people hurt themselves is wrong.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445653I think it should be in everyone's heart that letting people hurt themselves is wrong.
And I think people who consider themselves to be Christians should recognize the bit of God left in every individual to tend to their own affairs.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445653I think it should be in everyone's heart that letting people hurt themselves is wrong.
then where do you draw the line? if everything that's bad for you gets banned life would become insanely boring, and therefor perhaps more dangerous then all the banned products combined.
I guess this all falls under the freedom vs safety argument. I personally value freedom far greater as safety.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445653I think it should be in everyone's heart that letting people hurt themselves is wrong.
STOP MEDDLING WITH OTHER PEOPLE'S LIVES, YOU HAVE NO RIGHT IN FUCKING WITH WHAT THEY WANT TO DO, LIFE, LIBERTY, AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS MOTHERFUCKER
I LIKE CAPSLOCKS
Quote from: AlbinoClock;1445656And I think people who consider themselves to be Christians should recognize the bit of God left in every individual to tend to their own affairs.
Since when are Christians supposed to just lay back and let the cards lay as they fall? We're supposed to help people.
Quote from: PirateClock;1445660then where do you draw the line? if everything that's bad for you gets banned life would become insanely boring, and therefor perhaps more dangerous then all the banned products combined.
I'm not saying banning alcohol is the answer. I know people are too dependent on it to give it up, we already have plenty of evidence for that.
I just don't see the point of allowing things that have virtually no benefits and numerous drawbacks.
Quote from: Maltese;1445663STOP MEDDLING WITH OTHER PEOPLE'S LIVES, YOU HAVE NO RIGHT IN FUCKING WITH WHAT THEY WANT TO DO, LIFE, LIBERTY, AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS MOTHERFUCKER
I LIKE CAPSLOCKS
That's the thing, if what they are doing threatens their life, how is that supporting the right to life?
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445665I'm not saying banning alcohol is the answer. I know people are too dependent on it to give it up, we already have plenty of evidence for that.
I just don't see the point of allowing things that have virtually no benefits and numerous drawbacks.
The benefit is relaxation. Id say that's quite a large benefit.
also you are acting like people are taking large quantities of cyanide.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445669That's the thing, if what they are doing threatens their life, how is that supporting the right to life?
they have the right to life, and they can do whatever they want with it, thanks liberty and pursuit of happiness.
right to life, doesn't mean forced to live.
I have the right to an attorney, doesn't mean i'll always use it
Quote from: PirateClock;1445670The benefit is relaxation. Id say that's quite a large benefit.
Like others have said, if you need alcohol to relax, you have a problem.
I'm more talking about people with alcoholism or bingers than responsible drinkers.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445672Like others have said, if you need alcohol to relax, you have a problem.
I'm more talking about people with alcoholism or bingers than responsible drinkers.
And you have no right to criticize how they live.
they aren't hurting anyone, leave them alone.
Quote from: Maltese;1445675And you have no right to criticize how they live.
they aren't hurting anyone, leave them alone.
You're saying the families of alcoholics aren't hurt by watching their loved one wasting away from abuse?
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445680You're saying the families of alcoholics aren't hurt by watching their loved one wasting away from abuse?
I'm saying it's none of your business.
I'm not saying that alcohol is fine, alcohol actively shuts down every organ in your body, I'm saying that if people want to do that to themselves, they can, they're free to do that, this is a right that your ancestors fought and died for, so people can kill themselves with the drink if they wanted to
I also support suicide
Just had a couple Jägermeisters and now I'm going to post in this thread.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445665Since when are Christians supposed to just lay back and let the cards lay as they fall? We're supposed to help people.
I'm an atheist, please allow me to help you get rid of your ridiculous beliefs. You'd say something along the lines of, "No, fuck off."
Exactly.
Why's that? What possible reason do I have to not help someone if they are destroying themselves?
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445687Why's that? What possible reason do I have to not help someone if they are destroying themselves?
Because it's none of your damn business.
Quote from: GreyClock;1445685I'm an atheist, please allow me to help you get rid of your ridiculous beliefs. You'd say something along the lines of, "No, fuck off."
Exactly.
Yes, because Christianity is threatening my life :rolleyes:
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445687Why's that? What possible reason do I have to not help someone if they are destroying themselves?
The realization that they are adults who can decide for themselves.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445693Yes, because Christianity is threatening my life :rolleyes:
Christianity ruined more lives then alcohol that's for sure.
but let's not get into that.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445687Why's that? What possible reason do I have to not help someone if they are destroying themselves?
what reason do you have to meddle in other people's affairs?
you do not intend to help them, you intend to remove personal freedoms.
I'm done. You guys can keep your nonsense logic.
:hi5:
Marlin, you think you have the moral imperative to intervene into someone else's life; but not everyone agrees with your morality, and for damn sure, no one wants your help.
Most of us don't believe in an eternal after life of beautiful golden meadows and Sunday afternoon picnics. We just want to make the most do with this short life we got, and we don't need moral crusaders limiting that in any way, shape or form.
Quote from: GreyClock;1445718Most of us don't believe in an eternal after life of mooi golden meadows and Sunday afternoon picnics. We just want to make the most do with this short life we got, and we don't need moral crusaders limiting that in any way, shape or form.
THANK YOU
Quote from: Maltese;1445722THANK YOU
Says a moral crusader.
Quote from: Patriot's Bitch;1445680You're saying the families of alcoholics aren't hurt by watching their loved one wasting away from abuse?
Only butthurt. They're meddling too. It's not their business to tear themselves up over other people's choices.
Right... Well I'm not going to argue that alcohol can be very self destructive. That would be very silly to claim such a thing. I will say that alcoholism affects all age groups, and a silly law is not going to do anything about it. Besides if a 16 year old kid really wanted to get fucked up he could just drink mouthwash which is perfectly legal to buy. But then again nobody talks about that. And do you really think the lady at Wal-Mart is going to let her good Christian values get in the way of some kid buying a bottle of Listerine? At least the poor kid will be safer drinking cheap vodka. Not to mention at the age of 16 parents still have a say in terms of guardianship and medical care. At 18 odds are you'll probably have a friend who's 21 and will do packie runs for you. By then there is no point.
There's nothing wrong with helping people like Marlin wants to, but when you start to make it law that's where problems start. In all senses of the word (including morally) government is the problem.
Here buying alcohol is limited to 18, and you can buy from the supreme alcohol institute at the age of 21
but everyone drinks before that
only idiots drink irresponsible.
but I drink to much, and I just want to drink every second... maybe because I hate myself I don't know but alcohol just makes everything better.
They should make the drinking age 16 and the legally drunk age 21. Some people would follow it but no one would know anyway so...
Quote from: joliet_jane;1444276As always, crappy parents are a problem.
Tell that to the parents of all these floods of little 10 year old shits on XBL. I tell ya, it's torture. Something is really wrong if you meet foul mouthed homophobic 10 year olds on Gears of War.
Quote from: Not Blackmagic;1446054Says a moral crusader.
Religion is self destructive, but it also directly harms others.
Quote from: Ingram-J/WristbandClock;1446184Tell that to the parents of all these floods of little 10 year old shits on XBL. I tell ya, it's torture. Something is really wrong if you meet foul mouthed homophobic 10 year olds on Gears of War.
Actually this is a solid point. Video games are known for the off chance of hooking younger people causing problems. But we don't necessarily ban it. We put a silly little "M" label on a lot of games, but that doesn't stop much beyond buying it. It's not even that video games, alcohol, or anything else that can be addicting is the problem. The problem is bad parenting. If it were my kid, I'd just punish them.
Of course there's the argument that parents are busy and can't always watch their kids. If you have a hectic lifestyle where you or your spouse can't be there for your kid then either hire a nanny or stop having fucking kids. There are so many people in this world who shouldn't breed for the sole fact that they are irresponsible individuals. Parenting is a tough job, and the decision to become one isn't something that should be taken lightly.
By the way Maltese this thread is about drinking, not about how much you dislike religion. Yes sometimes religion likes to butt it's head into other people's business. In any such case, just close the door and tell them "have a nice day." That's the beautiful thing about this country is you don't have to listen to anybody. Furthermore religion is not the enemy, simply an opponent of a lot of legislation you'd probably like to pass. Instead of whining about the moral fiber, and institution of religion you should consider just making a better argument than them. To do otherwise would just be more of that silly ad hominem that you love to talk about. (See what I did there?)
The way we teach kids to be decent human beings is by setting a good example, and correcting them when they do something stupid. By correcting them I mean taking away their stuff, making them clean particularly unappealing parts of the house, grounding them, or something. Should you do this properly, they will more than likely turn out to be responsible adults.
With that in mind I'm all for responsibility, accountability, and liberty. Taking away booze is not going to solve the problem but rather contribute to it. We've learned this with prohibition, and we're learning it with every tax dollar we waste on busting up silly little backyard parties. I know I'm repeating myself, but I've yet to really be rebutted with anything.
Quote from: GreyClock;1445718Most of us don't believe in an eternal after life of mooi golden meadows and Sunday afternoon picnics. We just want to make the most do with this short life we got, and we don't need moral crusaders limiting that in any way, shape or form.
I don't know about all that golden meadow shit but I'm pretty certain consciousness doesn't go away after the death of the body and I still think we should enjoy what we've got while it's here. That's clearly what it's for.